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  #71  
Old 15-11-10, 15:26
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The CD only goes up to 1837, Merry! I'm sure I mentioned that before...
Did you? Sorry, I don't always take things in the first time! lol
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  #72  
Old 10-04-19, 22:43
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I don't know if anyone will remember this thread!

To save reading back....

When my 2xg-grandmother married in 1854 she said her father was John Saunders, coal merchant.

I still don't know much about him, but believe these three baptisms may well be three of his children:

My ancestor:

Elizabeth bap 05 Dec 1830 at St Augustine-the-Less, Bristol, parents John and Ann Saunders. Abode Anchor Lane, father's occupation Servant.

Her brother and sister:

George Augustus bap 23rd Sep 1827 at St Philip & St Jacob, age 1 month, parents John and Ann Saunders. Abode St Philip, father's occupation Coal Merchant.

Mary Ann bap 8th Feb 1829 at St. Phillip and St. Jacob, parents John and Ann Saunders. Abode St Phillip, father's occupation Brewer.

In 1841 Elizabeth and Mary Ann are together, but with no other family members. It seems likely George Augustus either dropped his middle name, making him difficult to trace, or died before civil registration began.

Until today I had no idea what happened to Mary Ann, but I think I might have cracked that now!

I think Mary Ann married Walter Sparrow in 1850. Unfortunately, I've not been able to find an image of the marriage entry (or a transcription including her father's name), but, apart from Mary Ann having the right age and birthplace in 1851, 61 and 71, she also has this son:

SPARROW, GEORGE AUGUSTUS
SAUNDERS
GRO Reference: 1855 D Quarter in BATH Volume 05C Page 628

Just a coincidence?? I might just fork out for the marriage certificate (unless someone can show me a reason not to)!!

If this is Elizabeth's sister, I can only hope the marriage cert gives me another lead on John and Ann.
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  #73  
Old 10-04-19, 23:31
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Here is the marriage cert but unfortunately they didn't bother to fill in father's name:
https://www.ancestry.co.uk/interacti...nSearchResults

Does the witness Elizabeth Saunders' signature match your 2xg-grandmother?
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  #74  
Old 11-04-19, 08:49
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Oh well done for finding that, Kate. Just goes to show, I didn't try hard enough because I didn't expect to find it!

Unbelievable about the fathers names!! No reason for Walter's not to be recorded, as he was a second child born three years after his parents married. Plus he (Walter) was in his parents household aged about 20 in 1841.

As for the signature - I was only able to get a copy of the marriage cert from the GRO for Elizabeth. All I can say is, she could sign her name, whilst her husband couldn't/didn't.

Anyway, here's a bit of better news! When I was looking to see who Walter's father was, I noticed his mother was Rachel Sparrow. This name rang a bell, so I searched for people called Sparrow on my tree, and, surprise, surprise, my Elizabeth Saunders had a son named Cornelius George Burchill and Cornelius married Ellen Rachel Sparrow!

Ellen Rachel was born in 1862 in Siston or Wick and Abson (next parish), Gloucestershire. Her father (from marriage entry and census etc) was John Sparrow, brother of Walter. This John may have been the John Sparrow who witnessed Walter's marriage. John did manage to name his father when he married and was living with his parents in 1841 and with his widowed mother in 1851.

So, quite good circumstantial evidence tying these families, though Cornelius George Burchill only had to travel about 5 miles to find a bride, so I suppose it could still be a co-incidence. I feel the net is closing slowly though!

Wouldn't it be helpful if, when Mary Sparrow died, her death was registered by her sister, Elizabeth Burchill?!! Not that I'd be any further forward with their parents, John and Ann Saunders.
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  #75  
Old 14-10-19, 08:57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by kiterunner View Post
Does the witness Elizabeth Saunders' signature match your 2xg-grandmother?
I had forgotten about this. Here's the witness signatures from the PR marriage entry of Mary Ann Saunders in 1850:



Here's the PR signature of my 2xg-grandmother four years later:



Are they the same person?

I know what I think, so please give your opinion.
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Old 14-10-19, 10:35
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I don't think so. Some of the letters are very different, for instance the "r".
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  #77  
Old 14-10-19, 11:16
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Hmmm, well, that's the opposite of my thoughts! In particular I thought the Elizabeth was a v good match, except for the E not being attached to the rest.

Even if they don't match (my signature only started to look the same over and over after about ten years and I was using it every day when I was working full time!) I still think these two women are sisters! I note that several of Mary Ann's children died in the time frame between Mary Ann's death and Elizabeth's death. I can see me gradually buying all the death certs on the off chance Elizabeth registered any of the deaths!!
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Old 15-10-19, 09:17
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Oooh, a result! Stronger circumstantial evidence!

I was trying to prove Elizabeth Saunders who married Charles Burchill was the sister of Mary Ann Saunders who married Walter Sparrow.

Here's the probate entry for Walter Sparrow:

SPARROW WALTER 9 July (1875). The Will of Walter Sparrow formerly of Doynton but late of the parish of Wick and Abson both in the County of Gloucestershire Yeoman who died 17 May 1866 at Wick and Abson was proved at Gloucester by Charles Burchell of Staplehill in the Parish of Mangotsfield in the said County Butcher and George Bryant of Wick and Abson Carpenter the Executors. Effects under £100.

So, Charles Burchill, his brother-in-law?!


I wonder why it took 9 years?
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  #79  
Old 15-10-19, 10:48
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That's useful, Merry.
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  #80  
Old 15-10-19, 12:26
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Yes. I'm presuming as there's no relationship mentioned in the probate index for Walter and Charles, there won't be anything further in the will.

Still debating about the death certs for the Sparrow family and whether there's any chance of a Burchill registering a death and stating their relationship! The problem is, Walter had a lot of family living nearer than the Burchills did so I suppose there's a greater chance they, or neighbours/friends etc, were involved when these deaths occurred.

This is just to remind me of who died when...

Elizabeth Ann (dau) 1854 aged 0 (there was an inquest and some blame was placed on the father for administering a quack medication that he was a local salesman for)

John (son) 1860 aged 0

Walter 1866

Mary Ann (wife) 1872

Alicia Jane (dau) 1873 aged 22

George Augustus (son) 1874 aged 18

Thomas (son) 1875 aged 16

Two daughters survived and married:

Emily Rachel married 1889 to Alfred Arthur Strange.

Mary Augusta married 1892 to Oliver Harold Strange.

Not yet checked to see if Alfred and Oliver were brothers or whatever.
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