Who Do You Think You Are - William Roache 26th Sep

[Shona]

Looking at the photo of the Old Mill Cafe - looks as if it was also a petrol station. Bill implied it was over-looked by Alton Towers, but isn't the building on the hill above the mill, Alton Castle?

[Margaret in Burton]

Originally Posted by Shona

Looking at the photo of the Old Mill Cafe - looks as if it was also a petrol station. Bill implied it was over-looked by Alton Towers, but isn't the building on the hill above the mill, Alton Castle?

Alton Towers / Alton Castle same thing surely.

Alton Towers overlooks the village of Alton.

EDIT:

No the castle is a different place. I never knew that.

The castle is a Catholic youth retreat centre. I SHOULD have know that as OH's rellie was a RC priest at Alton and is buried there.

[Olde Crone]

In 1861 (I think!) my 2 x GGF is shown on the census as being an Engine Driver and Grocer.

He was no such thing - his wife ran a little house shop but of course in those days a married woman would not have been expected to be employed on her own account - too demeaning for the poor hubby.

OC

[Shona]

Originally Posted by Olde Crone

In 1861 (I think!) my 2 x GGF is shown on the census as being an Engine Driver and Grocer.

He was no such thing - his wife ran a little house shop but of course in those days a married woman would not have been expected to be employed on her own account - too demeaning for the poor hubby.

OC

Ah - Alice Waddicor ran the shop, perhaps?

[Janet in Yorkshire]

Originally Posted by Shona

You're on to something, OC. Checking the Ratcliffes, I found:

1891 census - Leigh, Staffs

John Ratcliffe, 54, butcher, born Leigh
Mary Ratcliffe, 60, born Leigh
William Radcliffe, 31, son, butcher, born Leigh
Zillah Ratcliffe, 19, dau, dressmaker, born Leigh
Addie, 16, dau, born Leigh

Next door...
Mary Ratcliffe, head, widow, 77, pub innkeeper, born Leigh
Fanny Ratcliffe, grand dau, 32, born Leigh

In the 1881 census, the two families are living next door to each other and Mary has two grand daughters living with her - Fanny and Emily.

If the two households lived next door to each other or, very near, sometimes it was a case of sleeping next door because a) grandma was on her own and like company b) houses were small with cramped sleeping arrangements.
(My mother's brother, the only boy in seven children, used to go next door to the grandparents to sleep. Apparently he went for tea and came back after breakfast!) Census recorded who was sleeping at the address, NOT whose permanent home it was.

Jay

[Shona]

Some comments from William Roache:

“My great-grandfather James was very entrepreneurial and intimidating, as were my grandmother and mother,” says Bill.

“My mum was very loving and kind, but she had such strong determination.

“Her childhood was really tough. She was taken away from her home as a baby and brought up by another family – all because my grandfather was such a horrible man.

"Albert made her leave school at the age of 14 and work in a shop – even though she wanted to go to art school – because, while there was plenty of money around, Albert drank all of the profits."

Bill remembers his grandad well from his youth, but admits he “wasn’t very pleasant at all”.
“Albert was a waster,” explains Bill. “My mother hated him. Because of his drinking, his father – my great-grandfather James – gave all his inheritance to my mum. Can you imagine? He knew Albert would have blown the lot.”

Could Bill ever imagine cutting off one of his own children in such a way?

“If you’ve got a son who you know is a layabout, and he’s got a very strong wife who’s earning a steady income, then it is the sensible thing to do,” he says.

“James didn’t deny his son the money – in fact, Albert lived off the business’ profits – but he couldn’t touch the golden goose. That was wise.”

[kiterunner]

Are these things that he already knew before they made the programme, Shona? The bit about the inheritance contradicts what they said was in the will in the programme, doesn't it - that it all went to Aunt May.

[Shona]

Originally Posted by kiterunner

Are these things that he already knew before they made the programme, Shona? The bit about the inheritance contradicts what they said was in the will in the programme, doesn't it - that it all went to Aunt May.

After the show.

[kiterunner]

So we don't know what he actually had evidence for and what was assumed.

[Ann from Sussex]

Originally Posted by kiterunner

I presume that Albert Waddicor is the one in the 1945 National Probate Calendar, of Rutland House, Heanor Road, Ilkeston, Derbyshire, died 20 Feb 1945, administration to Florence Mabel Glover, wife of Charles Oscar Glover. Effects £6411 10s 9d. So it seems that money didn't always pass him by!

Originally Posted by kiterunner

And there is an entry for Mary Zillah Waddicor in 1941. Same address. She died 17 Nov 1940. Probate to Florence Mary Glover, Hester Vera Roache, and Albert Waddicor retired caterer. Effects £6147 11s 10d.

That will be them as William Roache's father was a GP in Ilkeston in the 1930s and 40s. I used to work with someone who grew up in Ilkeston and his father was her family doctor. Albert and Zillah obviously went to live with their daughter and son-in-law in old age.