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  #21  
Old 20-10-20, 09:02
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I was just reading the will of Philip Grout 1778 again and had completely forgotten that he asked for a matching headstone to his wife and to be buried next to her, but I imagine her stone hasn't survived or I would have recorded the inscription when I visited. The will suggests she was definitely buried in Braughing, but this doesn't appear to be recorded in the PRs. Now the images are available on FMP it might be worth a browse to see if there's any clues.

(no sign of any photos of any Grout stones in Braughing, sorry)

I must have accessed the monumental inscriptions records for Braughing as I wouldn't have recorded Philip's grave ref 'A4' without that. I don't remember paying for them though (!!), but I suppose I must have done. I'll have a look and see if anything comes to light later.
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  #22  
Old 20-10-20, 09:57
Jenthec Jenthec is offline
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Thanks Merry. Yes I registered with Essex Archives Online but I haven't paid a subscription yet as I already have copies of both those Wills. Philip G mentions his son Philip Jnr who is one of the Executors and also mentions his beloved wife Dinah, so that is how I know that we have the correct Philip and Dinah and son Philip.
James Grout d 1733 was a Tailor from London, leaving everything to his wife Mary. Don't think they are connected to my family.
I'll keep working on Dinah. Select Marriages have about 3 entries and they all spell Starky but that may be how it was written in the Marriage register. Interesting that the Hertfordshire Names Online has different spelling.
For now my focus is to try to find a baptism record for Philip Grout (various spellings) for 1703-05, if that Braughing Gravestone information is correct?? Many thanks for your help - we will get there (I've been saying that for most of the year in lockdown!!)
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  #23  
Old 20-10-20, 10:00
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I already have copies of both those Wills. Philip G mentions his son Philip Jnr who is one of the Executors and also mentions his beloved wife Dinah, so that is how I know that we have the correct Philip and Dinah and son Philip.
Yes, I have that will too, it's the 1778 PCC one. I meant the 1717 Essex will for a different Philip Grout (possibly the grandfather of Philip who had the PCC will).
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Old 20-10-20, 10:04
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I'll keep working on Dinah. Select Marriages have about 3 entries and they all spell Starky but that may be how it was written in the Marriage register. Interesting that the Hertfordshire Names Online has different spelling.
The marriage register definitely says more than just Starky. I would presume Herts RO will have looked at it properly! The image on FMP shows Starkyn, but the S could be into the binding of the register. I'll post the image if you don't have access to FMP.
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Old 20-10-20, 10:08
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James Grout d 1733 was a Tailor from London, leaving everything to his wife Mary. Don't think they are connected to my family.
Are you sure that's the same will? The one I posted about here says James was a collarmaker from Puckeridge, Braughing and I'm sure I saw his burial in Braughing too.

A collarmaker is a leatherworker (horse collars), nothing to do with tailoring!
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Old 20-10-20, 10:12
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I've just seen the will for James Grout, tailor of St Sepulchre on Ancestry. It was proved in 1731, two years before the death of James Grout whose will is on the Essex site and I'm sure was buried in 1733 in Braughing (I will check when I'm on my other computer as FMP doesn't work on this one!)
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Old 20-10-20, 10:26
Jenthec Jenthec is offline
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Oh help! I'm getting confused now..... need to go to sleep (Australian time!)
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  #28  
Old 20-10-20, 10:50
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lol I know the feeling!

Here's the PR for Dinah Starkyn(s)



So, the N falls into the spine of the register, but Herts Archives seem to think there is an S after the N.

I just checked James Grout. He was buried 30 Aug 1733 at Braughing and his will is the one in Essex Archives, not the LMA will for the tailor (the tailor was buried 2 Jan 1731 at St Sepulchre, Holborn)

Having failed to find a photo of Philip Grout's gravestone (1778), I'm going to look and see if I still have the bit of paper I wrote the inscription on when I was in the churchyard, to see if there are any clues about Dinah!
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  #29  
Old 20-10-20, 11:03
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Ok, so I've found the pieces of paper from our visit to Braughing and the surrounds. Goung by a photo of my children taken in Braughing churchyard it was probably about 2009/10.

It's probably easiest if I just type everything I've written, rather than trying to work out what you may or may not have......see next post....
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Old 20-10-20, 11:32
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I think we must have been to the Herts RO and looked at the transcribed monumental inscriptions and grave reference numbers for the churchyards as I've used pencil to write the inscriptions (no pens allowed in the archives!) and then I've ticked each one (different pencil!), presumably as we found them in the churchyard!

These are the Grout entries:

Standon:
Grave ref F114 - STTMO (sacred to the memory of) Mrs Sarah grout wife of Philip Grout dep. this life the 22nd May 1818 aged 71
Also Mr Philip Grout Jan 30th 1819 aged 82 (this one is ticked)

Braughing:
(right against the road in the corner)
A1 IMO Mary wife of James Grout who died at The Mount, Braughing on Nov 16th 1862 in her 70th year.
A2 - STTMO James Grout late of Puckeridge who died May 16th 1840 aged 60 years.
A4 - Philip Grout who died March 20th 1778 aged 73 (or Mar 3rd aged 75!)

(the above three are ticked, but I've not recorded any further inscriptions that we couldn't find, suggesting Dinah's grave was long gone.)

All the rest of the information I've kept is about my Smiths.

Now I'm going to look at the burial records for Braughing from the date of the last child baptised for Philip and Dinah in 1744 through to when he wrote his will in 1777 in case there's a clue about Dinah.

Back later.....
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