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#12
23-07-13, 11:52
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But I can't find him after that! Nor his death.
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#13
23-07-13, 12:39
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Have found some public trees on ancestry with this family on and they don't have John's death, but I have managed to find a parish register entry for one of Miriam's marriages (in 1918, Miriam Van de Water, widow, married Wilfred Vere Doughty) where she gives her father's name as Robert Lee, gentleman, and a Sutcliffe is one of the witnesses.
The reason I'm researching this family is that my 2xg-grandfather, Walter Horner Brown, left the following bequest in his will written in 1914, in the list of annuities he was leaving, after £250 per annum to his daughter and before annuities of £50 per annum to his nieces: To Mrs Bertha Lee of 42 Sutherland Avenue Widow an annuity of five pounds per calendar month during her life. There is a Sutherland Avenue in Maida Vale, so I reckon that Mrs Bertha Lee is the one in post #1, wife / widow of John Walter Lee. I always thought Mrs Bertha Lee must be a retired very long-standing employee, either domestic servant or maybe working for his company, or possibly a relative of his wife, but now I don't think so! I can't see either of this Bertha's parents, Philip Grzimish and Esther, who died 1889 and 1884 respectively, in the National Probate Calendar, and nothing for John Walter Lee, and Bertha doesn't have an occupation on any of the censuses, so I wonder how she was managing to support herself and three children, plus keep a servant, from "private means". What do you think, could she have been my 2xg-grandfather's "kept woman"?
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#14
23-07-13, 14:58
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John Walter Lee's father was named as Robert Lee, civil engineer, when he married Bertha. If Bertha and the children were estranged from John, then there may have been some confusion and, as a result, a mistake was made and Bertha's father was named instead of John.
I found this discussion about the Grzinish family on Rootschat. http://www.rootschat.com/forum/index...,376408.0.html
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#16
23-07-13, 15:11
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That's an interesting thread on RootsChat, thanks, Shona. I wonder whether Alfred Lee is the same person as Frederick Lee (son of Bertha). I shall have another go at tracing him now!
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#17
23-07-13, 15:23
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I've done quite a bit of research on the Doughty family of Grimsby.
Miriam's husband and the son of George Doughty MP, Wilfred Doughty, collected model boats, some of which are on display in Grimsby. The museum, where his model boats were originally displayed, was opened by his widow, MV Doughty, in 1958. I had read the article below before. Now I know exactly who Wilfred's widow was! http://www.thisisgrimsby.co.uk/Museu...#axzz2ZskjODeB
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#18
23-07-13, 15:26
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Fancy that! (I mean the article you posted, Shona. Small world!)
I've found Alfred Robert Lee's army papers on FMP and he gives his next of kin as mother Bertha of No 1 Flat, 20 Cathcart Hill and 2 sisters Lillian and Miriam. So he must be Fred from the censuses.
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#19
23-07-13, 16:35
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Grrrr - John Walter Lee is proving very elusive!
Bertha's family are a lot more obliging. I wonder if following Bertha's siblings may give some clues to her independent means. You'll have details of her family, but I'll type it up here in case anyone else feels inspired to do some digging. - Levi Grzymisch and brother Gedalia, alien arrivals, from Prussia, 17 June 1839. Profession, leather maker. - Gedalia, alien arrival, native of Germany, merchant (?), 18 March 1844. 1861 Houndsditch Phillip Grzimish, head, 43, jeweller, Prussia Ester Grzimish, wife, 36, Prussia Julia Grzimish, dau, 9, scholar, Finsbury Israel Grzimish, son, 7, scholar, Finsbury Bertha Grzimish, dau, 5, scholar, Aldgate Rebecca Grzimish, dau, 4, scholar, Aldgate Samuel Grzimish, son, 2, Aldgate Bernard Grzimish, son, 3 mo, Aldgate Mildred Mile, nursemaid, unmarried, 22, Stepney Maria England, general servant, unmarried, 22, Ireland Charles Semel (?), nephew, 17, jeweller's assistant, Prussia Philip Grizimish in Houndsditch on London Land Tax records from 1865-1871. 1871 Houndsditch Philip, 53, Posen, Prussia Esther, 46, Posen, Prussia Julia, 19, Finsbury Isidore, 17, scholar, Finsbury Bertha, 15, scholar, St Botolph Rebecca, 14, scholar, St Botolph Samuel, 12, scholar, St Botolph Baron, 10, scholar, St Botolph Adelaide, 8, scholar, St Botolph Kate O'Driscoll, 40, unmarried, general servant, Ireland
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#20
23-07-13, 16:50
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I still think that if my ancestor left her an annuity of £5 per month, he must have been paying her an income or paying her bills before he died?
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