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  #1  
Old 30-08-11, 09:13
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Default Eliza Hales (I think) Wk 4 MFMMMM

I have decided to put this up, though I only 'think' this is my great x 4 grandma and I also have no information on her at all apart from the name.

See my link to great x 3 grandma to why I think this lady is mine

http://genealogistsforum.co.uk/forum...harriet+bailey

Name - "official" name and what they were known as: Eliza Hales

Date and place of birth: 1810c, Possibly Navenby, Lincs
Names of parents: Unknown
Date and place of baptism: Unknown

Details of each of his or her marriages: A first marriage to Mr Smith, Unknown

Second marriage to Benjamin Bailey, 15th May 1849 at Christ Church, West Bromwich. Marriage cert listed father as Richard Hales, Farmer.

Occupation(s): None

Addresses where they lived (including county if in UK) - and please list which censuses you have or haven't found him/her on (if s/he lived in census times!).
The two probables I found of Eliza were for my great x 3 grandma Harriet. I still cannot prove if these two censuses were my Harriet and her mother.

1851: Low Town, Oldbury, Worcs (transcribed as Eliza Baley)
1861: Dingle Street, Oldbury, Worcs. Listed as Head, but still says married.

Date, place and cause of death: Unknown
Date and place of burial: Unknown
Details of will / administration of their estate: Unknown
Memorial inscription: Unknown

I appreciate I have no real info to go on so wasnt sure if I was allowed to post this or not.

I really think i've had a thread before about this lady but I cannot find it if I did (it could have been on a different website years ago )
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Old 30-08-11, 18:41
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So this is the info from those censuses you mention, so that we have the info to look at:

1851 Low Town, Oldbury, Worcestershire
Benjamin Baley Head M 41 Coal Miner Worcestershire Oldbury
Eliza Do Wife M 41 Do
Thomas Smith Son 18 Coal Miner do
Lucianna Do Daug 12 Do
Mary Ann Do Dau 11 Do
Charles Smith Son 4 Do
George Do Son 3 Do
Harritt Do Dau 2 Do
NK NK NK Do.


A Smith family next door who may or may not be related - Joseph age 59 born Oldbury with wife Elizabeth age 49 born Warwick and children Elizabeth 22 Thomas 18 and Joseph 16, all born Oldbury.


1861 Dingle St., Oldbury, Staffordshire
Eliza Bayley Head Mar 51 Lincolnshire Naveury
John Do Son Un 14 Forge lad Worcs Holbury
Harriot Do Daur Do 12 Do Do
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Old 30-08-11, 18:51
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So this is the same Eliza in 1871 at Williamsons Row, Burntwood, Staffordshire, and the surname Bedford ties the family up nicely with your Harriet (you mention on the other thread that a Susanna Bedford was a witness at Harriet's first wedding, in 1869 - I bet "Lucianna" is Susanna!)

Eliza Bailey Widow Widow 61 Lincolnse Navenby
Charles Smith Son Unm 22 Colliery Stoker Staffords Oldbury
Mary Ann Bedford Granddaughter 13 Scholar Bucks
Sarah Lucy Granddaughter 8 Do Staffords Burntwood
plus some lodgers.
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Old 30-08-11, 19:34
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Yes, this is Mary Ann Bedford in 1861 at Rounds Green, Oldbury:
George Bedford Head Mar 26 Labourer in Brickyard Twyford
Susannah Do Wife Do 22 Wor Oldbury
Mary Ann Do Dau 2 Do Twyford
Thomas George Do Son 3 mo Do Oldbury.

(Mary Ann's birthplace originally said "Do Do", i.e. Wor Oldbury, and then the second "Do" was crossed out and replaced with Twyford, but they omitted to cross the "Do" for Worcestershire out.)
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Old 30-08-11, 19:49
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This could be them in 1841? Oldbury was in Shropshire until 1844, according to Wikipedia.

Stone St., Oldbury, Hales Owen, Shropshire
Henry Smith 45 Lab N
Eliza Do 30 N
Betsey Do 13 N
Thomas Do 7 N
Susanna Do 1 Y
Ann Do 5 months Y
-
James Smith 20 Bricklayer N
Jn Armstrong 20 Lab S (= Scotland)
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Old 30-08-11, 19:54
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Aha! FamilySearch has a baptism for a Betsy Ann Smith at Navenby, Lincolnshire, 30 Mar 1828, parents Henry and Eliza.
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Old 30-08-11, 19:56
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And a baptism for Eliza Hales at Navenby, 18 Oct 1808, parents Richard and Mary.
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Old 30-08-11, 20:04
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I can't find Henry Smith and Eliza Hales' wedding. I've had a look through the Navenby parish register marriages on Lincs to the Past with no luck. But it does all fit together; I'm sure it is all the same people.
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Old 30-08-11, 20:08
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Hi Kite,

Thank you so much for looking at this family. I cant believe I never checked for Eliza on the 71 census and noticed the Bedford surname connection from Harriet's marriage certificate.

I am really happy to finally add Eliza Hales properly to my tree now.

I have to wonder now though who exactly is Harriet Smith/Bailey's actual father; Henry Smith, Benjamin Bailey or an unknown man She names Benjamin Bailey on her marriage cert and marries as Harriet Bailey but I am not fully convinced he is her father.

I have been looking for ages for the 41 census so I really appreciate what you have found and the baptism in Navenby which seems to confirm the family. Lucianna is quite a terrible mistranscription on the part of the enumerator for Susanna lol.

Thank you so much again Kite
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Old 30-08-11, 20:16
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Have you tried looking for a birth registration for Harriet, Claire? I guess now we know Henry Smith's name we could start looking for his death but it'll be tricky since we don't even know what county he died in! I would think he died not long after the 1841 census since there is such a big gap between Mary Ann and Charles on the 1851 census. But then if Benjamin is the father of Charles, George, and Harriet, why didn't he marry Eliza before? Or maybe Henry and Eliza were separated and Henry only died around 1849.

I wonder if we can find baptisms for any of the children after Mary Ann / Ann which give a father's name so we can work out when Henry and Eliza split up or Henry died.
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