Rosa Sarah Ann Thompson Gray

[Nell]

My ex's great grandmother was born plain Rose but chose to elaborate it to Rosella.

[Merry]

Glad you got her sorted.

My mother-in-law was Eileen Lucy Amy but never used her middle names, even though Lucy was her beloved granny's first name.

[Merry]

I'm afraid Arthur took his own life. There's a newspaper report here:

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/...0henry%20harle

If you don't have FMP I can type it out, but I'm a bit slow...

[Merry]

A longer report about the inquest:

https://search.findmypast.co.uk/bna/...t=rose%20harle

[Merry]

Originally Posted by Nell

How sad. Arthur junior died in Sep 1918 in France. I'm wondering if his mother became a nurse for the war.

Rose outlived her other son too:

HARLE, ALFRED VICTOR 35
GRO Reference: 1935 D Quarter in MITFORD Volume 04B Page 289

The third child, mentioned as dec'd on the 1911 census, was Daisy Clare, b and d in 1899.

Alfred Victor doesn't appear to have been married. Administration was granted to his mother (using her full name):

https://www.ancestry.co.uk/imageview...81&pId=5994193

[Nell]

Merry

Thank you for those links. I cancelled my FMP sub as I wasn't using it - typical. Thanks for the info about the other children. I couldn't find Daisy though I had a feeling it was a girl and must have been born 1899. Sometimes this hobby is so sad!

[Nell]

Looking at the probate record, I see Rose is using all her forenames. What a sad life, to lose her husband and all her children.

[Merry]

Originally Posted by Nell

Merry

Thank you for those links. I cancelled my FMP sub as I wasn't using it - typical. Thanks for the info about the other children. I couldn't find Daisy though I had a feeling it was a girl and must have been born 1899. Sometimes this hobby is so sad!

Births Mar 1899
Harle Daisy Clare W. Ham 4a 219
Deaths Sep 1899
Harle Daisy Clare 0 W. Ham 4a 133

[Nell]

Thanks again. Found her burial too.

[Merry]

WHETSTONE

THE SUICIDE WITH SCISSORS.

A CASE OF INSANITY AND DRINK.

An inquest, held at the Orange Tree, Friern Barnet, on Saturday afternoon, elicited evidence which cleared up the mystery attending the death of Arthur Henry Harle, painter and paperhanger, whose body was found in a field close to the High-road, Whetstone, on the morning of Wednesday, February 27th. As mentioned in our last issue the body remained unidentified for a time, but a portion of an envelope, post marked, which was discovered in his pocket enabled the police to trace him to his home at 28, Trevelyan-road, Stratford. He was a fair haired man, with the neglected looking face of one who had not shaved for a fortnight. With the exception of his having on two pairs of grey tweed trousers his attire exhibited no unusual feature; it was of the kind, rough and homely, in which a workman may well go to his employment. Over his morning coat and vest he wore a brown overcoat, and a black billycock lay on the ground beside him. There was a three-inch wound in his throat, rather to the right side, such as he could have inflicted by wielding in his right hand the paperhanger's pair of scissors which were found under him. Dr. G. Danford Thomas, coroner, held the inquest, and the jury, having been sworn and appointed Mr Southwell as foreman, viewed the body.

Before proceeding with the examination of the witnesses the Coroner briefly stated that the circumstances preceeding Harle's death and the discovery of the body in a field near the High-road at Whetstone. A certificate had been received from a medical man at Stratford, showing that the widow, Mrs. Rose Harle, was suffering from hysteria, verging on mania, and in the opinion of the doctor she was quite unable to attend the inquest.

Albert Ernest Harle, brother of the deceased, said that he was a draper formerly living in Leytonstone, but now residing at Newcastle-on-Tyne. He identified the body as that of his brother, aged 28 years, a paperhanger and decorator. He was married, and had three children. Witness, before removing from Leytonstone, saw the deceased about a month ago, and had seen him frequently before. Apparently he was doing fairly well in his businss and had plenty of work. His character was that of a steady man, although he gave way at times to drink, spending his money freely on such occasions. This was a source of trouble to him at home - The Coroner: Did you ever think he was likely to do an injury to himself? - Witness: Never to my knowledge. - You told us something of his habits, Did his mind become affected? - I have heard so. He suffered from depression, but I never had any reason to think he had delirium tremens. - On hearing of this affair you came to London? - Yes; I received a telegram on Thursday, and when I came his wife told me he left home on Tuesday morning as if to go to work. He was never seen alive again by his friends. He had been "on the drink" just before. - Do you know what his the slightest. There was no business that I am purpose was in coming to this district? - Not in aware of. - A Juryman: I take it your brother came here to work? - Witness: Her worked on his own account, taking contracts, but I do not know that he had any contracts in this district. - William Prentice, a farm labourer, residing at Whetstone, was the next witness called. He said: I work on Wyatt's Farm, and on Wednesday morning I noticed a man lying just inside the Bull field, near the hedge. I was looking round and caught sight of his face, which was looking very white. On going to look at him I could see no sign of life or movement. - The Coroner: Did you see any mark of injury? - Witness: Not at the time. There was some blood on the ground. I sent word to the farm and the police soon afterwards came. I heard afterwards from the police that he had injuries in his throat. He was a stranger to me. - Had he his hat on? - It was close by. - P.C. Thomas Webb deposed that about 11.20 a.m. on Wednesday he received information that a person supposed to be dead was lying in the Bull Field, where he found the deceased. Witness noticed a pool of blood, and a pair of scissors were underneath the body. (The scissors, a formidable pair of the kind used by paperhangers, were produced.) The divisional surgeon was sent for. Meanwhile the body was taken to the Finchley Mortuary, where witness searched it, finding as the result of his search three pennies, six halfpennies, seven farthings, some keys and papers. From part of an envelope bearing the Stratford postmark he traced the deceased. - The Coroner: Has anyone seen him about? - Witness: Not that I know of. - He was a trespasser? - Yes: there is no footpath, and he evidently entered the field through a gap near where the body lay. - Dr. J. J. Swindall stated that about 1.30 p.m. on Thursday he was called to examine the body of the deceased and its cold state led him to think that death had taken place many hours before, some time in the early morning. At an early hour there had been rain, which washed away the blood from the body, with the exception of some about the neck. - The Coroner: Was it a severe cut? - Witness: Yes; very severe, severing the large arteries. he must have died very quickly, as the scissors cut through the large blood vessels. - Could it be done with that instrument? (lifting up the scissors.) - Yes - A Juryman: He died from internal hemorrhage? - Witness: No; external hemorrhage. - The brother of the deceased was recalled, and in reply to the coroner stated that he went to a publichouse where the deceased had been employed and asked the barmaid whether she had noticed anything strange in his talk or dress. She told him that they had been unable to make any sense of the man's remarks at times, and Mrs. Harle also told him that Arthur had been strange. Yet in Witness' presence he had notseemed unusual. - The Coroner: Did he threaten his wife? - Witness: No, on the contrary his wife told me he had always been kind to her. He told her that he owed money to a man at the Traveller's Rest they said that was not the case. He had a horror of the police. - And that preyed on his mnd to some extent? - Yes. - I heard that your father was unfortunate in the same way? - I understand so. - The Coroner: That may show that mental feebleness was transmitted to one member of the family but not to another. Was he nervous and sensitive? - Yes. - The Coroner (to the jury): If he has been drinking and worrying his mind has given way. The act in itself is almost an insane act. He had a wife and children, a happy home, and was doing well in his business, yet he cut his throat. - The Coroner: He was a good workman? - Witness: Yes; he could have had plenty of work. - Inspector Leech explained that the farthings found in Harle's pockets were taken out of his child's money box. He left home as if to go to his work, and the next seen or heard of him was the finding of the body in the field. There was no sign of a struggle. There was no blood on the clothing, but the point of his collar was blood-stained. Seemingly he committed suicide whilst lying down. - P.C. Eyres, the coroner's officer, stated that when Harle left home he was supposed to be going to work, which happened to be only about two hundred yards distant. Although expected to have his dinner at home he took with him a quantity of bread and meat as much as would have sufficed for two days. he had not eaten any of it. - The Coroner, in his remarks to the jury, observed that it was sensitive, highly nervous men, often clever men, who broke down under a strain, and who thrugh this strain, and the effects of drink, became lost. The deceased seemed to be an instance in point. - The jury returned a verdict of suicide whilst in a state of unsound mind. - Acknowledgment was made of the service rendered by P. C. Eyres in discovering the identity of the deceased man.