Wilhelmina Coralie Versigny FFMM

[Merry]

OMG!!

I said in 1891 Coralie was mother to Richard Webb or his wife Elizabeth. Well the children in the house include David Webb aged 10 b Hackney. I went back to 1881 and looked for David b Hackney and he is probably David Logsdon son of Napoleon. So Coralie was mother to Elizabeth's prev husband??

[kiterunner]

But Elizabeth's name was Webb when she married Napoleon Logsdon in 1875 (head hurts).

[kiterunner]

Elizabeth's father was Richard Webb.

[Merry]

*Joins Kate in having a hurting head*

Napoleon Logsdon was still alive in 1891. RichardWebb (1891) was a cabinet maker like Napoleon, so was he using an assumed name. Do their ages match? I found a Richard Webb cabinet maker in 1881 whose age was two or three years adrift, but maybe he is a red herring?

*downs Panadol*

*goes to ballet class* lol

[kiterunner]

I don't know how old Elizabeth's father was because I just got his name from her marriage certificate.

[Merry]

Right, one step at a time.....I'm hoping there's just a wierd mistake, but it's easier to write it down.

1881; 2 Hope St Bethnal Green:

Napoleon Logsdon m 25 cabinet maker b St Geo in the East
Elizabeth Logsdon wife m 25 b Shoreditch
Frederick Logsdon son 5 b Spitalfields
Elizabeth Logsdon dau 2 b Hackney
David Logsdon son 1 b Hackney

On the same page is what is presumably Elizabeth Logsdon nee Webb's family, dad Richard 52 furniture packer b Shoreditch and mum Rebecca 50 paper box maker b St George Surrey plus several children aged 22 down to 12. The 22 year old is Richard Webb cabinet maker b Shoreditch, who I thought was Elizabeth's husband on the next census. I doubt she will turn out to be married to her own brother, so here goes.............

1891: 29 Regent Row, Shoreditch

Richard Webb head m 35 cabinet maker b Whitechapel
Elizabeth Webb wife m 35 b Shoreditch
Frederick Webb son 14 cabinet maker's assistant b Shoreditch
Elizabeth Webb dau 12 b Hackney
David Webb son 10 b Hackney
Alice Webb dau 9 ditto
Arthur Webb son 7 ditto
Lilly Webb dau 4 ditto
George son 3 ditto
Eliza dau 1 ditto
Coralie Scriven mother widow 57 b France British Subject

Hooray, in 1901 things are back to normal!

Elizabeth Logsdon is a 46 year old widow and she has Arthur and George with her (as Logsdon) plus another two younger children.

I think probably Elizabeth's brother Richard was living in her house in 1891 and there was some confusion over who the head of house was: Richard or Napoleon?!!

[Sue at the seaside]

Oh my goodness, I came back to this tonight (having been out all day with the parents) hoping someone had glanced at this. Mindblowing! I don't think it's all as confusing as it seems, but I'm going to print all this out to try to get my head round it.
Thank you

I have spent the evening going through all this, and I have to admit you have all got so much more out of this than I ever could. Tomorrow I have to take the parents home (to Essex) so won't be around.

Be back Sunday

[Merry]

Most likely death for Wm Scriven, 'husband' of Coralie (I have to call her that as I have trouble with spelling Whilhelmina!)

Name: William Scriven
Estimated birth year: abt 1833
Year of Registration: 1883
Quarter of Registration: Oct-Nov-Dec
Age at Death: 50
District: West Ham
County: Essex, Greater London
Volume: 4a
Page: 5

This is where my thought process went next....I looked for William on earlier censuses to see if he was previously married......couldn't see him easily in 1871, but in 1861 there's a William right age b Surry Southwark but living in Birmingham with wife Caroline. I don't know if that is the right man, but thought I'd look for a death for Caroline, half expecting either not to find one or to find one too late (ie after he was living with Coralie)........but I stopped short with the looking for Caroline death when I saw this one.....

Name: Caroline Williamina R Scriven
Estimated birth year: abt 1837
Year of Registration: 1907
Quarter of Registration: Apr-May-Jun
Age at Death: 70
District: Fulham
County: Greater London, London, Middlesex
Volume: 1a
Page: 217

That could be William's wife, but if I didn't know that Coralie had lived to 1911 I would be thinking this death was hers!! *another headache!!*

[Merry]

Well, there is a Caroline Scriven in West Ham in 1901, but she is consistently b 1832 and when she married (1859 to Alfred Scriven) had no middle names, so make of that what you will!

Where is Coralie's death? Ellen A Wright died in West Ham by the look of it - I forget the date now (1930s?), but you would think her mother would have died in that area too. The various Logsdon men died in other parts of London by the look of it, so no one moved very far.

[Merry]

Forget that last post as that 1907 death I think is for this lady:

Marriages Sep 1858

McCoy John Greenwich 1d 805
Prindible Ellen Greenwich 1d 805
Sargent Priscilla Greenwich 1d 805
Scriven Edward Greenwich 1d 805 <<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<<
Sutherland Caroline Williamina Rose Greenwich 1d 805 <<<<<<<<<

So, a complete red herring.

I still can't find Wm Scriven in 1871.