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  #41  
Old 14-10-21, 12:11
vita vita is offline
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Originally Posted by Lynn the Forest Fan View Post
I enjoyed it because I am interested in that period of history so was aware of Lettice being Elizabeth's cousin and marrying Dudley. When I saw that Josh was descended from Henry Rich, I googled to see if he was related to Richard Rich who was a key person in the time of Henry VIII and featured in A Man for All Seasons about Thomas more and of course he was. I do like Josh and found it interesting.
I also thought they pronounced Lettice wrong
I'm also interested in that period of history but hadn't made the connection between Henry & Richard, so thanks for that. A Man for All Seasons is one of
my favourite films, In fact, I've downloaded it & intend to watch soon. John
Hurt played Richard, if I remember correctly. And what a great Actor Paul
Schofield was - such a loss.
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  #42  
Old 14-10-21, 12:13
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Originally Posted by Ann from Sussex View Post
I would be fascinated to know how they know how a particular name was pronounced, given changes across not merely time but also place, and within society.


I think sometimes you can deduce how your ancestors spoke and pronounced words by the way names were written in the records. During the 17th and early 18th centuries we found quite a few girls baptised with the name "Easter" in OH's tree. It was when Esther began appearing in the later records for same family that we realised that Easter was probably how they pronounced it, at least in Leicestershire at that time. In my own tree I have lots of 19th century Henrys in my London families, some of whom appear in the census as "Enery".You can just hear it being said in a Cockney accent! It made me laugh and reminded me of "Enery Cooper".
"I'm 'Enery the Eighth, I am ...........!"
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  #43  
Old 14-10-21, 12:19
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Originally Posted by Ann from Sussex View Post
I was expecting a reference to Amy Robsart when they were at Kenilworth talking about Dudley's efforts to persuade Elizabeth to marry him. As far as I can remember I don't think she was mentioned was she, or, indeed, the fact that Dudley had been married at all before he married Lettice?
Yes, as I say, it didn’t really register until later, that there was no mention of her… and I think I’d learned of her, and the ‘scandal’ because of learning of local history and the connection of the Knollys family locally. With Cumnor, Greys Court and Mapledurham being close by.
Maybe it might have gone on too long if she’d been brought into the story.
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  #44  
Old 14-10-21, 12:40
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I was half expecting that too Dorothy, but I suppose they thought it wasn't strictly
relevant to Josh's history.
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  #45  
Old 14-10-21, 13:02
Olde Crone Olde Crone is offline
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Hmm. According to some sites, the name Lettice is pronounced - Lettice! As in salad.

I have a very very long run of Amy as a name in one branch of the family, back to marriage settlements where the name is spelled Emme! Personally, I am inclined to accept the variant spellings as being phonetic of the time and a good indicator of what the scribe heard.

I have a family named Henshaw, thousands of them. Back in the 1600s, the parish clerk fumbled while writing the w, tried to correct it and made the slopes bigger. It looks like Henshall - and forever after, that is what this branch of the Henshaws were called. If course, it could also have been a tongue tie speech impediment, which makes a w sound like an l. All meant to catch the poor innocent researcher out.

OC
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  #46  
Old 14-10-21, 13:26
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Originally Posted by Olde Crone View Post
I have a family named Henshaw, thousands of them. Back in the 1600s, the parish clerk fumbled while writing the w, tried to correct it and made the slopes bigger. It looks like Henshall - and forever after, that is what this branch of the Henshaws were called. If course, it could also have been a tongue tie speech impediment, which makes a w sound like an l. All meant to catch the poor innocent researcher out.
I believe the w / ll ending variants are pretty common in the Bristol area just because of the local accent.
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  #47  
Old 14-10-21, 13:33
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Ann from Sussex Ann from Sussex is offline
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When it comes to writing down what the writer thought they'd heard, pity the poor registrars, vicars, census enumerators et al who had dealings with the German immigrant family who settled in London in the 1800s and from whom I am descended. I give you the Kannegiesser family. I have come across around 20 different spelling variations in the records, all for the same family. I am thankful I am descended through one of the daughters so didn't end up with it being my surname. It's no wonder that the grandfather of one of the male line descendants who I am in contact with Anglicised it to King!
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  #48  
Old 14-10-21, 13:43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Ann from Sussex View Post
I would be fascinated to know how they know how a particular name was pronounced, given changes across not merely time but also place, and within society.

.
When I was reading about Lettice Knollys, I saw mention of her name origins -
And found this

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Letitia
So maybe that explains the pronunciation in the programme.
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  #49  
Old 14-10-21, 16:26
Jenoco Jenoco is offline
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Yes that’s right Jennie - I worked there for a while.

I suddenly thought as I was dropping off to sleep … about Amy Robsart and the rumours about her death which didn’t put Lettice off marrying Robert Dudley…. So This morning I read the Wilkpedia article on her…. After Dudley died she married Sir Christopher Blount. The Blount family own Mapledurham House which I’m sure you also know of…. A later Blount married into the Spencer family which would make Josh a (remote) cousin of Diana - Princess of Wales.
There's also Blounts Court in Sonning Common/Peppard, probably connected to the same Blount family. Coincidentally, it was bought by a member of the Knollys family sometime in 1841.

I didn't know about the connection to the Spencer family.
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  #50  
Old 14-10-21, 17:02
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There's also Blounts Court in Sonning Common/Peppard, probably connected to the same Blount family. Coincidentally, it was bought by a member of the Knollys family sometime in 1841.

I didn't know about the connection to the Spencer family.
Oh yes, I recollect the road, but didn’t realise there was an historic house there (now seen it on Google). Part of the estate is currently for sale @ £4.5 million!

The Spencer connection wasn’t mentioned in the programme, I read of it in the piece about Lettice Knollys. Again ‘too much information’ for the programme.
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