Thank you how did you find it I spent most of yesterday afternoon and evening looking!

I searched on FMP for John Winfield or Wingfield with provision in the keyword field. Then I looked on Ancestry when I had some census info since I haven't got an FMP sub. But I doubt that he is the right one, i.e. your Emma's father.

You're probably right of course but you never know, I am missing a John Wingfield born 1828 although born in London. I can only hope. I will do a bit of digging about to see what comes up.

I have been in and out of trees in Australia and the USA. Also NSW and Tasmanian BMDs, just looking for snippets or just one clue who she was. I think I will send for her second marriage to Henry Moorhouse to see what her father's name was on that one.

Update: Recieved second marriage certificate for Emma Driscoll nee Wingfield and Henry Moorhouse 1890.

Father John Wingfield no occupation but now deceased. Witnesses John Fortune and Emma Buckley.

Emma's address 204 Victoria Dock Road, Custom House.

Consistence with lies or it was the truth.

Recapping:
Emma first marries in 1879 in Shoreditch to Pierce, a widower with small children.
Subsequent children born in the London area.
On that first marriage, she says her father is John, a provisions dealer. On the next marriage she maintains that his name is John, but simply says he is deceased.

You can't find her (or him!) before the first marriage, and there are never recognisable family members with her on the census.

Am I right so far?

Yes except Pierce Driscoll had one daughter by his first wife Margaret Howey.

Both Margaret Ellen and Pierce Patrick were Emma's they both travelled to USA in 1891 including Adeline by Henry Moorhouse with Emma, while in the USA Adeline died aged 4 and Emma had another two sons and a daughter by Henry Moorhouse named Henry, Lillian and Walter.

I have been looking at John Wingfields who died between 1879 and 1890.

One sticks out John Wingfield born approx 1811 died 1884 Poplar but that is as far as I got he is on 1881 census in his own Dock Labourer.

Wingfield John 73 Poplar 1c 383

A provisions dealer may be a term to impress a new husband.

I found this in 1901:
https://search.findmypast.co.uk/reco...1%2F0013044969


John Thomas Wingfield widower aged 73 retired baker, blind, born limehouse, with a live in servant and her relations.


Where was your missing John born?

Southwark.

https://search.ancestry.co.uk/cgi-bi...ae16f3d7c73a46

But the one you have found was born 1811. Could his birth date really be so far out?

No but it could be a Wingfield connected the next tier up. On the DNA match the ones I have seen seem to be descended from Pierce Patrick but I am trying to find one descended from the Moorhouse children because in those Pierce Patrick Driscoll trees it is very possible it could be someone else (can't see it though) other than Emma but my Wingfields are apt to dissappear frequently.